Hacker Newsnew | past | comments | ask | show | jobs | submitlogin
Will You Help Me Repair My Door [video] (youtube.com)
290 points by etc-hosts on Jan 7, 2023 | hide | past | favorite | 124 comments


The song from his previous music video about the raid is much catcher IMO (https://youtu.be/ISe3IVBBbyU). Also, going through his channel it's crazy to see how prolific he's been.

More on topic, the raid seems like a total miscarriage of justice- these sheriffs rolled up in camo and busted in like they were storming bin Laden's compound. All that work to confiscate 2 joints (its actually kinda funny, I would've assumed Afroman would have a lot more... Although he does have a song about how he only needs 2 zigzags)

They aso tried to civil forfeiture $5k in cash but ended up giving it back. Afroman did a whole thing with the local news where he went to the sheriff to pick up the money, and they filmed him opening the evidence bags. The count cMe up short. $400 went missing while the money was in the evidence locker, whoops.


I posted this one because it's a tiny bit more family friendly than the one you mentioned.

This scandal makes me think the Constitutional Sheriff movement might be very bad.

https://www.themarshallproject.org/records/2587-constitution...


For those new to the term "Constitutional Sheriff"

> The Constitutional Sheriffs and Peace Officers Association (CSPOA) is a political organization of local police officials in the United States who contend that federal and state government authorities are subordinate to the local authority of county sheriffs. Self-described constitutional sheriffs assert that they are the supreme legal authority with the power and duty to defy or disregard laws they regard as unconstitutional. As a result, they may sometimes be referred to as sovereign sheriffs.

via https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitutional_Sheriffs_and_Pe...

Terrifying.


Technically, under Constitution Article VI most (all?) Sheriffs would be bound by oath and Constitutional Law (Articles III, IV, VI) to defy or disregard laws they regard as unconstitutional. This is because unconstitutional laws are treasonous (an opinion reinforced in the Supreme Court in 1803 by Chief Justice John Marshall).

Per Marbury v. Madison (5 U.S. 137): "It is emphatically the province and duty of the Judicial Department to say what The Law is." and "A Law repugnant to the Constitution is void." (Opinion of the court via Chief Justice John Marshall).

As legally authorized officers of the Judiciary, Sheriffs and their deputies are obliged to interpret and act upon the law.

Not terrifying at all: this has been the status quo since 1803.

If you find this terrifying, do not become a Judicial Officer. These people handle treason on a daily basis.

P.S. I sympathize with Afroman, and support and appreciate his music. As intelligent citizens, I think he knows the law as I do, perhaps even better than me (because he's a celebrity).


Time to get that EU passport kids.


Please don't. It's....er....full of terrorists here, portions are only half, there's a war 24 hours drive away, our politicians are not our representatives [apparently], we speak different languages and even dialects, clothing sizes are really fucked up - your XXXL might be hard to find - amazon is delivered by disabled people only, one part of Europe uses different money and a new part of Europe just got the same money as the rest of us, putting a big flag of 'your' country outside your house is seen as a bit odd (dickmove) unless the world cup is on, 'world' usually means just that when it comes to sports, our paper money denominations are different sizes so we can't fuck over the blind, we use the metric system (mostly), Piers Morgan and John Oliver come from over here, we have kings and queens -still, no 2nd amendment rights, pay is shit and we're all communists because a doctor will treat you after a more urgent case even with a gold AE card, but you don't have to pay much in the end so that's communism, too. In Holland, if you don't have a bicycle they fine you, in Finland you have to buy moose-knuckle-fish and in Spain if you're awake you absolutely have to report to work at least once a month unless you're french and then you can just set fire to it, unless you're italian and then everything is debatable, anyway. Until it comes to the Germans. Their vehicles, though technically 'superior', are indicator-free and, much like an actual Panzer, are free to go where they want, unless an Audi is involved. No-one cares for VW anymore, which is ironic, but real Europeans don't really get irony, like yourselves oh crap now I'm starting to sell the damn place. Er.....no guns!


No guns? How are you gonna defend your constitution against a treasonous dictator?

Oh I see, Belarusian friend tells me you just get tortured and flee to another country by thousands then.


That's nothing more than a fantasy, it's not 18th century anymore with a group farmers being qualitatively not too far from a military.

If you escalate from peaceful protests to armed conflict, then a modern military will win over a bunch of farmers on any given day, provided that rules of engagement are loose enough. What good is your AR-15 covered in patriotic Eagle stickers against A-10 Thunderbolt?


Actually, I have a little experience on that. The main thing is that it's pretty hard to convince "modern military" to kill their own families or neighbors. So, in case like Belarus, if you order your military to fight like 90% of population, you have very high risk of them turning the arms the other way.

But if those 90% of population can be silenced by a very small filtered force (personal guards, but better call them "riot police"), and keep the real "military" in barracks fed by propaganda 24/7, preventing talking to people -- then they would learn the truth anyway, but when it's too late, when all the leaders are already dead/jailed/exiled.

The whole point of legitimacy rests on public approval. What approval are we talking about if it needs "A-10 Thunderbolt" against your own people. If an american city, say, Portland, would start armed resistance, no President would ever order airstrikes against it, that would be the last day of their presidency. But they won't start it, because the whole system already accommodates Portland wishes into non-violent resolution.

A side note: Napoleon military genius rests a lot on the La Grande Armée, the largest army by far in Europe. But why other countries didn't have their own armies of the same size? Because only democracy can keep such a big army to turn the arms against its government, otherwise at some point giant army wishes may not align with its government (although it may take time of course). Democracy at least persuades people that they have a voice. So, in some sense, the Napoleonic wars made "democracy -> large army size -> democratic neighbors" transition.

Going back to Belarus example, if the "riot police" would have to deal with armed protestors, they would have it like million times harder, and I'm not sure of the outcome.


> As a result, they may sometimes be referred to as sovereign sheriffs.

I'm sure that'll work about as well as that "sovereign citizen" thing that some people try.


What is the connection between this incident and the Constitutional Sheriff movement?


no direct connection

I think the Constitutional Sheriff movement and idolization of local sheriffs is troubling.


>The connection is I wish there was one

Okay lol.


Very few sheriffs had the guts to publicly state they would not enforce unconstitutional covid mandates.

They were unconstitutional. That has been proven.

It was illegal for officers of the law to enforce them.

I don't think the primary law enforcement problem in the US is Sheriffs. Say what you will about police. These are not the same organizations.


What specific mandates were proven unconstitutional?



The Supreme Court didn't find that the employer vaccine mandate was unconstitutional, they found that it was outside of OSHA's Congressionally-approved powers. Statutory law, not constitutional.


Hahahhha

What!? The revisionist history begins

https://eppc.org/publication/bidens-covid-vaccine-mandates-a...


Am I missing something? A 300 word piece by a think tanker?


Honestly, I don't blame you. A genuine news release from a .gov site was not on the first couple pages of search results. However, that is by design.

https://gov.alaska.gov/supreme-court-decision-forces-biden-a...


That political press release doesn't support your earlier point that it was proven "unconstitutional." In fact review of the SCOTUS opinion shows that they (6-3) found that OSHA exceeded their congressional authority, not violated the US Constitution.

> “Although Congress has indisputably given OSHA the power to regulate occupational dangers, it has not given that agency the power to regulate public health more broadly,” the court wrote

If you want to show how this was unconstitutional then you'll need to show something else entirely. This SCOTUS opinion isn't proof of that, no matter if it is from a ".gov" site or not.


It does dawn on you that this is expressly written in a manner which entices the idea such congressional authority exists. And yet does not mean that the authority exists. One cannot grant what it does not have.


Indeed, the mandates began under the previous president.


Sorry, I'm not a team player.

But, please feel free to provide additional information


I’m not a team player either. I’m not sure what information you’re seeking.


Guy, you need to get over the covid thing.


Get over the fact that a third of people in the country will go along with anything they're told and another third are so craven and cowardly they'll accept any answer at all to assuage their own fears?

Oh, alright.


Can you please stop making everything about COVID. There haven't been new mandates and there isn't a new world order and we're not all dying from the vaccine. Just please stop making everything about COVID. Please.


Are you talking about mask mandates or vaccine mandates?


Executive orders issued by the Biden administration

https://www.swfinstitute.org/news/90658/supreme-court-rules-...


The OHSA mandate never went into effect as far as I know. Besides even if it did go into effect it wouldn't be something a sheriff would enforce, as it is up to OHSA to enforce its mandates.


The administration used news outlets to pump the mandate and companies preemptively executed the order.

OSHA does not yet have any policing powers, this was an attempt to generate them.


So what does this have to do with your original claim of police enforcing unconstitutional mandates? Nothing? I'm losing the thread here...


I watched that video when this was going around on reddit recently. That "white supremacists on my premises" hook is one of the slickest rhymes I've heard in a while.


He predicted my own interpretation of what I saw.


I like this one better because it cracks me up more then the other music video.

Let me ask you something officer, any kidnapping victims inside my suite pockets?


Watching this video is a reminder that if we could just enforce a minimum level of cardiovascular health via something like a three mile run time limitation or something like that the police force would naturally weed out people with poor impulse control and probably be overall a more humane and decent force.


There's already a problem with roided-out cops, who aren't going to have any problems passing your hypothetical three mile run test. You're probably thinking in particular about the fat guy by the cake, but I've met guys of similar build in the cycling community who have no problem riding a imperial century in six and a half hours.


Dudes on a cycle with big red swollen faces and gynecomastia aren't going to run 8 minute miles. HGH maybe but that's a different class of PED for different reasons.


This is an extremely naive understanding of how anabolic steroids work. Side effects such as the two you've listed here — respectively: upregulation of the RAAS pathway causing increased blood pressure and sodium retention, and a failure to include an aromatase inhibitor to prevent the conversion of testosterone to estrogens — are relatively rare, especially to a degree where they'd be highly visible.

Also, an 8 minute mile is not a particularly high bar to clear and with the increased work capacity granted by basically every single popular steroid (funnily enough, HGH would probably not confer immediate/direct benefits in this scenario in the same way that less exotic PEDs could) it would be trivial for most users to do with little to no preparation.


Sorry for being unclear: the roided up and jacked cops are one problem. The overweight ones are another. The former are more likely to have problematic attitudes (specifically: roid rage) than the latter, which your proposed physical fitness test would not catch. And I'm noting that you might be surprised about the level of aerobic fitness in some fat people (the latter).


>minimum level

Meditating again on the conflicting requirement that:

1) Cops be intelligent, physically fit, free of troublesome political biases, cool under stress, be willing to risk being shot by criminals and,

2) Not be paid $500,000 a year.

"Cops are paid too much" is an evergreen topic on sfgate. Here's a recent story: https://www.sfgate.com/news/article/S-F-overtime-costs-soar-... If you want the best of the best of the best, you'll have to pay for it.

"Pfft, I could do that." Okay, why aren't you? Quit your tech job today and head to the police academy. Hmm? You don't want to? That's odd...


> Hmm? You don't want to? That's odd...

Well. Police is a cesspool. Police world is the closest you can get to being a criminal without being a criminal. Very few people want that for themselves.

The fact that being a criminal or being nearly a criminal pays so little is only one of the factors why people want none of that.


This is a silly comment. Physical fitness requirements are hardly unusual (they have them in the UK for example). Nobody is asking that police are "the best"; just that they're not the worst. $500k is a hilariously far-out figure.


> Not be paid $500,000 a year.

How much is this in comparison to the costs of defending or settling lawsuits against the police department as a result of bad cops?


My brother, I live in a town of 40k people. We pay over $20m a year to cops and their pensions. There is no crime here.


I’d also accept a shift to Public Counseling over Policing. Nobody in that job needs most of what makes a Cop a Cop; attitude, equipment, expectations, training, reward and belief systems.



  When asked for comment, Adams County Sheriff Kimmy Rogers said the result of a neighboring sheriff’s office investigation into Afroman’s claim is imminent. He also that the attention the rapper’s songs have generated has turned into a wave of threats against his deputies. “I can handle it, but I don’t appreciate some of the messages coming in about Adams County deputies getting ambushed, ‘I hope they die slow,’” Rogers said. “It’s kind of tolling on some of the officers. I doubt that your family would want that said about you.”
The Adams County sheriff presumably knew Mr Afroman has at least 2 kids, a son and a daughter, but they broke into his house wielding long guns, pistols, and a riot shield anyway.

I like the part where a deputy is poking around behind the couch with his gun.


“We can break in to your house with guns, but don’t say mean things about us.” is about what I would expect from US cops.


Consequences. Adams County Sheriff Kimmy Rogers is looking for the word 'consequences'.


Can someone tell me about the person dressed in full camo gear and sporting an assault rifle during the raid? Do police departments outsource some of their work to third party contractors for raids like this? Is this person part of some local militia?

Shot of the person I'm talking about at 2m11s [0].

[0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oponIfu5L3Y&t=131s


I think the correct term for why he's dressed like that is tacticool.

Gotta make sure you break up your silhouette using a desert camo pattern in the well-known desert of Adams County, Ohio.


> ... in the well-known desert of Adams County, Ohio.

... interior


Multi cam works surprisingly well in green forests.

It’s weird that there’s only one LEO in multicam and the rest are in black uniforms.


Presumably SWAT captain, for dealing with the possible threat of well-armed cartel dens.

Afroman has good taste though, those HS-5s sound beautiful, surprised he didn't spring for the 8inch subs though. Guess it's simple if you're not mastering jungle.


>> Can someone tell me about the person dressed in full camo gear […]

> Presumably SWAT captain, for dealing with the possible threat of well-armed cartel dens.

Was the operational target a structure in a wooded area where this individual needed to sneak up on without visual detection? Is that the reason for the foliage-coloured camo?

Because it does not look like the operation involved sneaking around a wooded area to me.


Correct to question it. The reason is simple: Police units cosplay as military units. (going so far as to call themselves “paramilitary.”)

Couple that desire to cosplay with a large funnel of tax dollars going to purchase military purpose weapons for potential use on domestic civilians and we have a resultant system no different than high-school aged kids wanting to prep for airsoft.

Except it is different. They have the ability (and sometimes even the express desire to) escalate and potentially kill other people.

Outside of the due process that is the law they swear to uphold when sworn in to service.


Look up some photos of police during the Ferguson protests. In US, SWAT loves camouflage and, more broadly, anything that makes them look "operator".

It has done a full circle now where companies that design camo patterns make ones specifically for police, such that they don't have any actual camouflaging purposes, but still look like camo (and not just boring plain blue or whatever). The language used by the manufacturers to describe them is very telling, e.g.:

"The MultiCam Black™ pattern was developed to meet the unique requirements of law enforcement officers operating in high-risk environments. It projects a distinctly authoritative presence appropriate for domestic operations. MultiCam Black™ is designed to complement an officer’s existing equipment and present a sharp, professional image for top-tier law enforcement units."

(here's how this "authoritative presence" actually looks: https://i.imgur.com/TqyzNJp.jpg)

Or here's another one:

"Ghost was derived from both A-TACS iX and LE-X. Ghost is designed and a tactical option for Military, Government and Law Enforcement Urban Operations. Ghost combined eleven variable shades of neutral grey that not only gives it and aggressive look, but it is also very effective in urban settings."

(https://i.imgur.com/jteSPvH.jpg)


Isn’t the point of those monitors that they are standardised to sound like a median domestic audio system? That feels like the opposite of having exceptional sound.


If you look at the frequency response the intent is pretty clear, hearing everything from 60-100Hz at exactly the same volume is... surreal. They're more for mixing and leveling presumably, mastering (and having a nice musical arrangement) is a more involved process where you can seek to have the features of a track be more broadly compatible.

https://www.google.com/search?q=HS-8+frequency+response&tbm=...


This guy rewinds.


The image of the kids drawings next to the door being broken in is quite shocking. This undoubtedly happens to people who don't have the means or the reach to record and put a video out for millions to see. What's a shame is that if Afroman is ultimately successful in getting compensated for what appears to be a pretty meaningless raid, it won't come from the police but from "low hanging fruit" like local libraries or similar :(


This isn't the first time he's been robbed by police

https://thebigfootdiaries.blogspot.com/2015/02/afroman-puts-...


Someone called up Adams County Sheriff Kimmy Rogers and asked him what happened to the kidnapping victim.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Yq--7qKwLk


Looks like you need to have a hidden camera system monitoring your camera system.


Yeah I wonder on what grounds the police can start unplugging shit in your house. This also happened in the Adrian Schoolcraft case - when the police burst into his house to take him in he was recording audio on one device which they found, unplugged and destroyed ... but they failed to find the second device (which is how we know). It's kinda wild how if the police might have a grudge against you, you'll have to setup multiple recording devices in case they break in and do some illegal shit.

There's a reason there's a song called "Fuck the police" and none called "Fuck the ambulance service" or "Fuck the firemen"


Supposedly it's not legal but they do it anyway.

https://www.quora.com/Can-police-disable-your-security-camer...


See Public Enemy, '911 is a Joke', https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZDIitWz8Go


A song that laments how 911 ignores poor/black neighborhoods embodies a different sentiment than "fuck the police."


I can see where you're going but I don't think these are the same. So on the one hand we have a song that describes how the police systematically target and brutalise black people in the USA and lays out the hatred and distrust the community feels towards them as a result. And on the other we have a song that says emergency services ignore black people due to the same systemic racism.

I mean I'm editorialising a little, but while both suggest that black people are getting a pretty rotten deal decades after people usually thing the struggle for civil rights for black people were fought and ultimately won ... one indicates real, visceral hatred towards a single institution which has famously and repeatedly been confirmed to be well deserved (and additionally as a phrase or slogan is itself very well known around the anglophone world). The other does neither.


the argument the police use is that the cameras could assist a bad guy in an ambush


Afroman Raid warrant

https://imgur.com/a/t7PkJJo


What is the safest (from a privacy perspective) and easiest way to set up in-home cameras?


In the context of a raid such as this ... you'd want, at least, visible hard wired camera's (not WiFi - jamming) going to a NAS box (for storage) with a distinct colour network cable from that NAS apparently direct to the main router ..

The cunning part is to have additional hidden cameras hard wired within the studs going to a second well hidden NAS box that takes the direct mirror feed from the first NAS box via a hidden diversion of the seemingly direct cable.

The intent is to have sacrifical cameras and sacrifical storage .. along with additional cameras and mirrored sacrifical camera + additional storage .. and then optional encrypted offsite backup.

Cables Vs WiFi is interesting - cables can be traced, but they are harder to remotely tap or jam.


WiFi can be made as hard as cables to be intercepted or jammed if you're interested in investing in a nice equipment which uses laser communication in non-visible specter.


Safest != easiest, you can't necessarily have both, at least not without decent expense.

"Safety" from a "privacy perspective" depends on your threat model, and how you feel about cloud storage. There are obviously options which don't use the cloud, which can range from cameras storing on local microSD cards, to cameras that feed to a local Linux box running ZoneMinder.

The "easiest" way would be the "camera with microSD storage" option, with options ranging from the likes of Dufy and Waze, to Reolink and others.

Aside from running your own "NVR" type box locally (or remotely/colo), if you're not happy with cloud providings from the likes of Eufy, Ring (owned by Amazon), or Nest (owned by Alphabet), a number of cameras support Apple's HomeKit Secure Video (HKSV) -- which just pushes video through an Apple HomeKit hub (Apple TV, HomePod, etc.) rather than a third party cloud provider.

Your privacy goals may differ from others -- whether it depends on who the cloud storage is with, or no cloud storage at all, whether you want wireless or hard-wired cameras, and whether you're concerned about any local storage potentially being removed from the property.

You'd need to give more information on what you're looking for, for folk to advise -- alternatively, there are more than enough sites and blogs with comparisons and write-ups of home surveillance offerings.


The author seems to admit that narcotics on warrant were justified (or at least logical). I am not sure what his expectation is. Aren't you risking years of jail because of that alone? Seems wildly irresponsible if he has family and kids.

On the other hand, I don't know the full situation and trying to infer information from this submitted video.


I read a commenter say he had two rolls of weed or something which is legal in most states now (I don't know where he is). But not just narcotics but even kidnapping or just about any charge really, are you saying destroying property, needlessly traumatizing children, going in armed like it's world war three or they were hunting for bin laden, stealing his money and disconnecting cameras so their actions won't be recorded. Are you saying that should be expected under any scenario?

Please don't feel insulted but I feel like your comment is a result of poor civic education in America. I say that because everyone should know that guilty or not you are afforded the benefit of doubt and you should be treated like an innocent person, even if you are caught red-handed in a crime until the due process of a lawful judicial proceeding finds you guilty. This means, cops have the responsibility to behave professionally, respectfully and freaking knock on doors, avoid the display and use of military weapons, holster their weapons until there is an actual threat. Again, the lack of education in these matters is widespread, most don't know their basic rights (not just you). If you see the condtions of Jails (not prisons) in america, it is appalling, really, my takeaway is the rule of law or the constitutional rights of people are absolute jokes, rendered that way because of lack of education. To think that an innocent person with no due process or legal proceeding could be locked in solitary for months or be in an environment where they are sleep deprived and sleeping on concrete, getting raped and beat up, medical procedures against their will, losing their jobs,healthcare and housing all because the public tolerates this type of bullshit or the type of bullshit you see here where act like they're in afghanistan, because "big strong man with guns and badge good guy,can do whatever he want".

So, no, what I have seen in the video is unacceptable whoever the target is, short of an active shooter, terrorist or dangerous fugitive.


First of all, all information I had was from the video. Author specifically circled "trafficking in drugs", not "possession" in warrant picture as a thing he clearly shows intent of admitting (at least in the song video). I don't know the full story, but its not linked here, so I went with the information I had.

>are you saying destroying property, needlessly traumatizing children, going in armed like it's world war three or they were hunting for bin laden, stealing his money and disconnecting cameras so their actions won't be recorded

I am not saying anything, just trying to understand people's reaction with the limited information. It seems conflicting to me.

>Please don't feel insulted but I feel like your comment is a result of poor civic education in America

I am not from USA, I am from EU. In EU, in quite a few places at least, police does not even need a warrant. If they think you are doing a crime (using drugs, possessing drugs) - they can just bust in to your house and arrest you. So compared to that, USA judge granting warrants system sounds great to me. Then again, I don't know everything, maybe you have similar laws as well.

>Regarding busting in instead of respectful knocking

From one side I do agree that innocent people shouldn't get swatted. But, from another perspective: If you don't break in fast - criminals will one hundred percent destroy the evidence needed to put them away.


> I am not saying anything, just trying to understand people's reaction with the limited information. It seems conflicting to me.

I'm not sure how anyone could explain it to you if you have no automatic reaction to what happens in the video. The amount of force used seems to me to be obviously excessive for the crime Afroman is accused of (that is, selling weed), to the point where I don't see how I could possibly clarify further.

Perhaps one thing may help clarify: whether he's guilty or not is mostly irrelevant to my reaction to this footage. Even if he's guilty, that's excessive force for arresting a weed dealer. The only thing that could change my mind is if the police could produce believable evidence that they had good reason to think he would be violent (such as a record of violent incidents, or membership of a violent gang; the warrant at least does not specify any of this).

The cops refuse to show evidence that they had reason to believe he is a violent criminal (and as the aggressors here, it's on them to provide this), but they barge in as if he's a terrorist with plans to blow up a primary school. If that doesn't provoke any sort of "this is deeply unjust and a massive abuse of power" reaction in you, I don't expect any amount of explaining will result in you understanding people's reaction.


>If that doesn't provoke any sort of "this is deeply unjust and a massive abuse of power" reaction in you, I don't expect any amount of explaining will result in you understanding people's reaction.

In most of the world trafficking drugs is a serious crime with jail. Maybe in USA it is different, I admit I don't know. My original comment was that it is highly irresponsible to be doing that with a family. My first automatic reaction was how can someone with kids do that, not how police responds.


It's a serious crime; it's not a violent crime. You don't see the cops busting down doors and charging in with riot shields and shotguns to catch your average white-collar fraudster, even though fraud is also a serious crime. This level of violent entry can only be justified by a reasonable belief, founded on evidence (which the police refuses to produce), that the suspect will be violent.

(As an aside, there's no evidence that Afroman is guilty of selling drugs; that makes it even harder for me to understand why your first gut response is to think "how can someone with kids do that". There's no reason to think he's guilty, apart from blind trust in the police's word.)


> There's no reason to think he's guilty, apart from blind trust in the police's word.

In my experience there’s a very deeply ingrained sense that police are the good guys lingering in average suburban Americans of a certain age. (I’m sure in others too that’s just my background.) It’s really hard to discuss these kinds of topics with someone that by default accepts that police action implies necessity.


Your initial post didn't seem like a question as someone who doesn't live in the US, it seemed to me more like an accusation.

As someone from south america living in the EU it seems to me fairly strange that it's not immediately apparent that the sort of violence depicted from the police is completely unwarranted - I've seen police raids in both south america and in the EU, and this level of going in fully armed with military-grade gear is only reserved for the most extreme of cases and /always/ supported by a court order. There's no argument whatsoever in that search warrants with no body of evidence should involve SWAT-team levels of response, which clearly was not the case as there's enough evidence to go around that the search warrant is literally a piece of paper that anyone can invent without need to provide supporting evidence for their claims.


First,pardon my ignorance, I became one of those people who thinks everyone on the internet is an american.

> From one side I do agree that innocent people shouldn't get swatted. But, from another perspective: If you don't break in fast - criminals will one hundred percent destroy the evidence needed to put them away.

This isn't an american thing, it's a basic principle of justice all humans know. It is better for the guilty to get away with their crimes than for the innocent to be punished wrongly. One reason among many for that is, you can compensate financially but you can't unpunish someone. You can't remove the trauma, lost time and suffering. But for the guilty, if they get away today you can cartch them another day. And there will always be guilty people who get away with wrongs. But it is easy to prevent innocent people getting punished, simply have a good standard of evidence and trial and the presumption of innocence.

Another thing to consider is cops are being lazy when this happens. Any idiot can take a gun and break through a door. It is the responsibility of cops and the government to stay a step ahead of the bad guys and use their money and resources to build a case. In this case for example, if they suspect the evidence will be destroyed then monitor who goes in and out of the place and arrest people as they leave or intercept sewage if they discard something. Monitor all entrances and communications. The warrant allows them to search which includes surveillance. They can use undercover cops. If they absolutley have no choice they can send an unarmed person who doesn't look like a cop to knock and get a repsonse. Then send armed (gun holstered) cops to ideentify themselves and within 10sec of no response break the door and politely but respectfully make sure everyone leaves so they can search and even then they must have a very good probable cause! And lastly, if the person is innocent they should pay them for the damages and provide counseling and any other support or treatment, especially for children.


I can't believe I'm pointing this out on HN of all places, but if making a song about weed gets your house raided and is considered probable cause, then the government is infringing your first amendment rights.


Warrant picture shows 'trafficking in drugs', not making a song about weed. I am not sure about full context.


I’m not sure if you’ve had much experience with American police, but having an accusation written on a warrant is rarely proof a crime actually occurred.


It's definitely a deterrent to saying certain things.


Don't forget the kidnapping!


If you confess to a murder, the fact that your confession was protected First Amendment speech doesn't mean you shouldn't be convicted of murder. What's the difference between that and your example?


If a playwrite playing the lead character in their own production stands on stage and confesses to murder, surely that should be seen as part of the work and not a confession of the playwrite. When it comes to musicians doing the same thing, the US has a long history of selectively prosecuting black artists.


Proportionality, I would say, but I'm not from the US and don't know US (case) law so I might be way off here.


Producing art about a character committing a crime is different from admitting that you’d committed a crime. One is art, one is (hypothetically) an admission of guilt. That’s the difference.


I’m telling you, the only way out of this mess is to eliminate qualified immunity, and becoming a cop should entail forfeiting many civil rights in exchange for insurmountable amount of power a cop has. US police is basically a military, and should be treated as such.


At the very least, a federal department to review issues with local police departments is necessary.

Right now cops investigate their friends and themselves. It’s global news when one decides to even fire (not even arrest) a friend despite video evidence of a crime. This shouldn’t happen. It should be possible for the public to submit evidence to a federal police review board and let them handle investigations in a less biased manner.

When a cop carries out an illegal search or decides to kill someone in a fit of rage as often happens, that should be well out of the domain of local police investigation and should go straight to the federal government.


Replying to the dead comment below "They’re low skill jobs..."

Being a /good/ cop requires very high skills, and it's an unavoidably political job, so I think a union is going to be an essential part of it. I agree that the current situation in much of the USA is really bad, though.


It’s funny because this unionized force is also one of the main anti union forces in the country.

It’s why generally on the left, cops are not considered “valid jobs” to be protected by a union. It’s a state sanctioned violence force.


Unions are basically a compromise between a monopolized labor force and the monopolizer. Given that the administration employs the officers, the union is usually seen as unavoidable; however, you have to wonder if the solution might be to go the other way.

You might sever the connection between the police force and the administration and reduce the size of departments down to the level of details and make them all much more directly accountable to the judiciary and the population they police. In larger areas the details can offer support and oversight in a way they are currently unable to.

There are tons of things a prevalent and inexpensive internet connectivity was supposed to drastically improve. This should be one of them, to remove the need for severe top down military style policing that intersects with administrative politics.


Police forces seem to work just fine without such measures in other countries. I wonder if there are any studies on what the difference is or the differences are that cause the discrepancy in violence.


Not really. When there's something wrong at the local level it's obvious they can't investigate themselves. People from central authority show up to sort things out and see who's ass needs to get fired without paying attention to any local power structure.

The only chance for local police to get away with it to keep it from reaching the central at all.

It doesn't mean that central won't try to cover the ass of local if the reputation of the whole police is at stake.


We absolutely have this in the UK. The IOPC are the body who people can complain to about police conduct and would investigate. I presume most normal countries have such a thing.

I believe any death is automatically referred for review, even if there is no evidence of wrong doing, as it’s so unusual.


Finding out Afroman is raising his family in one of the most impoverished parts of Southern Ohio was strange. I wonder if he doesn’t have much $ in the form of royalties flowing in.


He had one rather silly hit that became popular, then overplayed and annoying soon after. He's done some other ventures, small concerts, etc since, but I don't imagine he has a fortune.

If he was able to buy a nice place and retire, I'd say he's financially smarter than 99% of celebrities.


His wife is from there.

Maybe it's nicer than Hattiesburg.


Being nicer than Hattiesburg is very easy!


Because I got high made a ton of money, and he would have made a lot more if 9/11 didn't happen. There's a nice documentary on him and that song. Seems like a genuine guy.


But did it make a ton of money for him? The music industry isn't exactly known for putting artists first (i.e., musicians often don't make anything until all the expenses, advertising, promotion, payola, etc. are paid).


I was also surprised by this aspect of things. A quick Google at one of those net worth estimation sites pegged him at a net worth of about a million, which isn't exactly going to buy a mansion in Beverly Hills (or even Columbus).

More than me, though, and the guy seems to be having fun. I followed the link in the video to his Twitter page thinking it might have more information on the raid... Instead, it's almost exclusively videos of him signing the boobs of his fans. Gave me a good chuckle.


He lost some money to the DEA (forfeiture) and some to the IRS (bad CPA)

https://thebigfootdiaries.blogspot.com/2015/02/afroman-puts-...


Well, he was interviewed by the YouTube channel Vice and there he was showing off loads of marijuana at his place. So the police got a warrant and stormed the place.


Wouldn’t one expect they’d lay charges then?


And the kidnapping charge?


It's wild that the cops aren't held liable for this


Read up on “qualified immunity.”

My only slightly exaggerated take is that police on duty can do whatever they want to whomever they want - up to and including killing someone - and not be held liable.


From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qualified_immunity :

In the United States, qualified immunity is a legal principle that grants government officials performing discretionary (optional) functions immunity from civil suits unless the plaintiff shows that the official violated "clearly established statutory or constitutional rights of which a reasonable person would have known".[1]

I'm sure killing people violates clearly established constitutional rights, so the concept looks puzzling.


"clearly established" doesn't mean what a sane adult would think it means.

A web search should turn up plenty of blogs by lawyers ranting helplessly about whatever the latest absurdity was.


Well, that's why cops carry a drop knife or throwdown pistol, to plant on somebody they wrongly kill in the line of duty.

Dave Chappelle's "Sprinkle some crack on him and let's get out of here" wasn't just fanciful comedy.


Sometimes they are but then very serious people say it's a tragedy.


I can recommend the article “How US police training compares with the rest of the world” by the BBC: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-56834733


Damn, this is so sad. Just when we think we have developed. Also I just remembered memories of listening to Because I Got High on the radio.


OMG. This man must be treated as a national treasure.


The transition of hackernews to reddit accelerates it seems.




Guidelines | FAQ | Lists | API | Security | Legal | Apply to YC | Contact

Search: