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Setting up a business in the Netherlands is literally one trip to the nearest KVK office and about 30 minutes of your time.

I wouldn’t say that’s very difficult.



Setting up a business also involves compliance with every law related to your business, hiring employees, purchasing services for the business, etc etc. All of these things are more onerous, expensive and difficult here.

I've been involved with many startups on both sides of the ocean. In America (for better or worse) you get up and go. In Europe, simple things like creating a contract and paying someone are way more difficult and the barriers are much higher. Everything from the address you register your business at to protecting yourself legally is an issue.


Yes, Europe better protects it's workers.

Thankfully, the EU puts workers' welfare above a single person's idea(no matter how excellent somebody might think their idea is).

> Setting up a business also involves compliance with every law related to your business,

??? That's a bad thing? I'm delighted that businesses have to comply with minimum standards before they can trade.


Come on. Have you even read my other comments? I'm NOT saying to scrap worker protection and I'm NOT saying that all minimum standards should be killed.

My point is this: The EU has a ridiculous amount of bullshit laws, like this one, that make it harder to be a startup. These laws do not benefit the consumer at all.

It's idiotic arguments like yours - where people automatically assume hurting businesses is being pro-consumer - that has got us to the current stifling regulatory climate.


Which bullshit laws were unnecessarily harmful to you and that provided no benefit to the surrounding ecosystem?


Literally this one! The very law this thread is here because of!

Furthermore, it's a death by a thousand cuts scenario. It's not as if the Kill All Startups Act of 2009 is the one thing crushing European innovation, and by repealing that bill we solve all problems. Everything from transferring shares in a company to complying with GDPR to the address you register your business at to how to protect yourself legally is difficult here.

For many laws involved, I like the law but dislike parts of the implementation. For example GDPR. Given the choice between GDPR and no GDPR I'd prefer to have the GDPR. But there are a lot of issues in the implementation. There's entirely contradictory advice on the Internet from trustworthy sources on what is and isn't compliant. A number of lawyers suggest the use of arcane popups where you have to manually deselect each of hundreds of individual trackers. This strategy is used on a large number of websites now, including many popular ones. Is this compliant? Nobody knows! Even after spending many hours researching the GDPR and carefully crafting a plan based on advice from trusted lawyers you still might open yourself up to massive liability. The LOW tier of fines is _the higher of_ €20 million or 2% of your annual turnover. By making a simple one-person website I suddenly expose myself to a minimum of €20 million in liability! Now, is that fine likely if you make a good faith effort? No, but it is possible!

Here's an example of my mental calculations for starting a small website, based in the Netherlands vs. the US.

Netherlands: Hmm, I want to start a small website to sell widgets. First, I've got to form the company. Ah, shame, I'm not legally able to register the company at the address I live at. I've got to rent a shell office. Ok, time to go to a sketchy company and pay them €1200 per year to use their mailbox. I start to set up a website; I have to hire a lawyer to interpret many of the complex and interplaying laws around websites, widget selling, and small businesses in the EU and the Netherlands. After spending thousands, I'm ready to set up the site. I build my company, but it is an expensive process as many things I need cost far more than they would in America. Everything from pens to keyboards to hard drives is substantially more expensive. The site is now running, after spending a very large amount of money. I hire someone. They seem motivated and start working hard. Unfortunately, their output slows. My business is choking. I can't afford an unproductive employee. Dutch law means I can't fire the employee without their permission. I've got to take them to court or a public authority. I hire a lawyer again, and prepare the case. I show clear evidence that their firing would be justified. The employee resists, however, drawing out the proceedings. My bank balance nears zero. After a long and hard battle I win; the UWV decides that their firing is justified. As part of the "win", however, I must still compensate the employee many thousands of euros of salary, keep them employed until a set time, and pay myriad other costs. This drives me deep into bankruptcy. Because I am a small business, I am also declared personally bankrupt, and my assets are seized.

America: I want to make a small website to sell widgets. Wow, I get free grants from the government to encourage small businesses, nice! I set up the site and buy some widgets. I hire a local lawyer to ask about any relevant laws I've got to comply with. We sit down and for an hour of his time I now feel that I am sufficiently legally protected, and sleep easy. A few weeks later I get invitations to participate in the local business community. Wow, I'm invited to dinner with the governor of the state! My business expands and I hire someone to start shipping widgets. They work great for a few weeks, but then they stop working as quickly. My business struggles. After giving them some time to improve, their output is still low and I fire them. I hire another employee, and my business grows again; eventually, I retire on a yacht.




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